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Royal Family Question

PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2003 12:14 am
by Dragon Master
If a royal person, say a queen marries a non-royal. Would she still be the queen. Would her husband be a king? I need to know for my storyline.



PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2003 12:24 am
The closest I could find was the story of Prince Albert and Queen Victoria. He was a consort, and not a king after they married....
Maybe someone in Europe could tell you better.. :D

The Freak

PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2003 12:31 am
by Glencaer
that depends on which royal family you're talking about. there aren't really any hard and fast rules. But here are some things ive seen:

1. King Edward VIII of England had to abdicate his throne in order to marry his true love, Wallis Simpson, an American.

2. Currently, Queen Elizabeth II's husband is known as Prince Philip. However, Elizabeth I did not marry because her husband would be a threat to her power.

i suppose somewhere there is a rules of royalty somewhere, but I dunno where.

hope this helps.


PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2003 2:16 am
by Jojo

I think that depends on the tradition of the respective kingdom. And maybe the title how the married part is called is different in the country itself and in the surrounding countries.

For example the husband of Queen Elizabeth II is Prince Philip and by the marriage he became Duke of Edinburgh. I think his status is "prince consort".

Before their marriage the wife of the Swedish King Carl XVI Gustaf was Silvia Sommerlath, a commoner. But now she is Queen Silvia, not Princess Silvia. Perhaps she is called "Königin" (= Queen) only in Germany because the Germans don't have royals and look enviously upon their neighbours :-) However, she too is not the souvereign but only queen consort.



PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2003 4:17 am
by architect
To the British, please correct me if I am wrong.

Usually, if the princess does not have brothers and becomes Queen at her father's death, she stays Queen and her husband is named as a prince. Unless of course he is already a King in his own country. Occasionally, such as in the case of William of Orange, joint control of the monarchy is granted to the husband and wife. This happened for King William and Queen Mary. Did parliament grant this title?

Ben E.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2003 1:05 pm
by David Girard
I depend s on tradition and also on period of time.

For England case: the Queen Elisabeth II is the Queen and is husband is a Prince. She stayed the Queen. But in medieval time and later, if the only child surviving was a girl she was the Queen, but when she married the kingdom inerhit to his husband. So she was Queen until she married. It's why Queen Elisabeth I refused to married in 16th century.

In France, the Question was simple. No girl have been Queen, and when they weren't surviving boy child, they find an heir in the near family. So it was nephew or cousins. The next of Kin. In France, princess can't inherit and moreover they can't transmit it to their childs. But that's only the case for royalty. They have been many duchess in France. It depends on Duchy tradition too.

So it's your choicie :wink:

PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2003 8:49 pm
by Bruce N H
Hey Jojo,

Is there any modern-day carryover in Germany from medieval aristocracy? Some countries (e.g. Great Britain) carry over the titles, though largely symbolic), others had violent revolutions (e.g. France) and cleared out the aristocracy. Where does Germany fit into this? I know there was no king, but there were lots of little princedoms etc, right? Did any of the pagentry survive into the present? Or is it only an intresting geneological fact for people tracing their family tree to say "my great-great-great-great-grandfather was once duke of such-and-so"?


PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2003 11:42 pm
by Jojo
The ancestral seat of the family of Hohenzollern, former Kings of Prussia
and Emperors of the German Empire (1871-1918)[/url]


Bruce N H wrote:Where does Germany fit into this?

Well, the German revolution was not as radical as the French, Russian and even the Austrian Revolution. In Germany the regency of the aristocracy ended right after the first World War. The Kaiser (emperor) was sent into exile to the Netherlands and the regency of the kings (there have been kings in Bavaria and Saxonia) and dukes in the several "federal" states within the German Empire were terminated. However, though there have been bloody riots none of the kings and dukes were executed. They were smart enough to abdicate and with that they paved the way for the first German Republic, called The Weimarer Rebublik (For some reason the first parliament didn't sit in Berlin but in Weimar, the town of Goethe). By abdicating the former regnant souvereigns avoided both suffering from riots and losing their titles. Yes, it's true, the grand-grand-grandson of Wilhelm II is still "Imperial Highness" (kaiserliche Hoheit), a grand-grand-grandson of the last king of Bavaria still is "Royal Highness" (königliche Hoheit). The aristocratic families kept their personal estates, titles and names (i.g. Georg Friedrich Ferdinand von Hohenzollern = of Hohenzollern), only losing the gouvernmental power. They are allowed to elect and to run for gouvernmental offices like anybody else, of course only in democratic manners. And they fill the yellow press.

In Austria it's slightly different. They completely disestablished aristocracy. And they went even further, as they also deleted the "von" in their names. So the grand-grand-grandson of the former Austrian Emperor which family had put the Emperors of the Holy Roman Empire for several hundred years now is simply called "Herr Habsburg" (= Mr Habsburg). Well, most Austrians still show enough respect for former titles to address him "Imperial Highness" and "Herr von Habsburg", but that's the inofficial way. The Emperor became a commoner like every other citizen.



PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2003 2:40 am
by Dragon Master
Thank you Legofreak, Lenny, Jojo, Ben, David, Bruce, and Jojo again. I'm glad to see that you guys are so Castle and Royal saavy. I wish that there were titles in America. Even if I wasn't royalty, I'd still think it was cool to have a king. I wish I lived in Europe, there is such rich history there. I love America and American history. But we missed out on castles and nobles. I'm moving to Norway :twisted:

Wish me bon voyage!

*climbs on his trusty dragon Drakeon*

The Dragon Master and Drakeon

PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2003 10:58 am
by stuifzand
In the Netherlands, princes and princesses can marry non-royal people.

If there's a queen, her husband will be named prince, because a King is higher in rank than a Queen. That is not the case, because the queen is ruling (well, on paper) and her husband isn't.

If there's a king, his wife is called queen for the same reason mentioned above.

So, in The Netherlands we will have King Willem IV (probably, he's named Willem-Alexander) and Queen Máxima. Of course, that will be after Queen Beatrix has stepped down :-)

Máxima is a non-royal, but she will be named queen after her husband becomes king. I think that is something the government decides. Other titles are given by the Royal family (if I"m correct). Máxima is already named princess. That's the titel girls get automatically when they marry a prince of The Netherlands.

I'm sorry but I just love it to live in a country that has a monarchy

PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2003 9:04 pm
by Dragon Master
I'm sorry but I just love it to live in a country that has a monarchy

No need for the tiny type :) I don't hate the idea of a limited monarchy. I would love to live in a contry where they did.

{I am in no way against the president or government of the United States of America}


PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2003 5:54 pm
by medib
There may not have been kings, royalty, and castles in
North America, they were ruled by Kings of Europe.

USA was once Britain's 13 colonies, and the titles of
British Officers were Sir(s) and Lord(s) ... eg the Commander of British Forces in American Revolutionary
War - General (Lord) Cornwallis. And I'm sure the
governors of the various colonies were still addressed
as Viscounts, Dukes, etc.

Before the 7 Years War between France and England
which took place before the Revolutionary War, Quebec
was a Royal Colony of France, ruled by a Governor,
managed by an Intendant, and there was one Bishop
(to run the religious and civil affairs of the colony).

Back to the original question about Queens and Kings,
before Queen Elizabeth I reigned, Queen Mary married
the King of Spain, and the jointly ruled both Spain
and England.

Thanks, Ben M.

PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2003 6:16 pm
by David Girard
Hey Medib !
You know a lot about Quebec history. :wink:
Just a small correction, however. Before England conquest (1759), Quebec was called "Nouvelle-France" (or "New-France" in English). Quebec name append later.

There was no King or Queen here.

PostPosted: Wed Dec 31, 2003 5:03 am
by groovyd2001
In true medivel times the male would become the king. Thats why the Queen in shakespear's time didn't get married she knew that when she did the male would become the rulaer of her country. I hope that will help you in your story. 8) 8)

PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2004 1:25 pm
by David Girard
The Queen in shakespear's time was Queen Elisabeth I.